Vegan Powerlifting Part 1 - Balance8Life An intervew with Jim Gurtner

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Vegan Powerlifting

An Interview with Jim Gurtner

Have you ever thought about the fact that vegan powerlifting could actually be a real thing?

Welcome to the plant-based, power-loaded life of Jim Gurtner! He has won championships as a powerlifter. Jim has also competed as a bodybuilder, and accomplished this all on a vegan diet. This man impressed me from the moment I first met him.

I was intrigued by the fact that Jim was able to be so  successful with bodybuilding and powerlifting on a  plant-based diet.

As some of you may know by now, I am a vegan. I promote a healthy vegan diet for weight loss and weight (muscle) gain. And as a result of this lifestyle, I have caught a lot of flack for it. I am not the only one though. Jim has as well. You’re about to see how he maneuvered around all of this and still accomplished his goals. He did this on a vegan diet, invalidated pretty much every vegan-muscle building myth, and beat the stigma that goes along with it.

It has become apparent in recent times that bodybuilding, muscle gains and powerlifting are very attainable on a plant-based diet. Jim proved this fact way before it was cool.

After I started my blog, I contacted Jim and asked him if we could chat. I asked way too many questions and got a ton of amazing answers. As a result, I will be continuing this interview in Part 2 next week. (I was going to shorten it, but there’s just too much awesomeness to cut out).

Jim has taught me so much. If you are new, or advanced, there are a lot of great tips in here that I promise you, you have never heard of in your life!

Read below to discover how you can build muscle and take your regime to the next level and accomplish this on a plant-based diet!

THE BEGINNING

I was raised a vegan. For me, it was a way of life. I almost half-way expected Jim to be the same way. (I’m not exactly sure why, cause let’s face it, that’s not exactly normal.)

When Jim and I first started chatting, I asked him if he was raised eating healthy and living in the gym. To my surprise, Jim said that was not the case. In fact, when I asked him if he was raised vegan, his answer was, “No! My brother, sister and I were raised on the 4-food groups taught in almost all schools in the 60s and 70s: The meat, dairy, vegetable, and fruit groups were our mainstay.

“My father, was a smoker and a beer drinker had no interest in nutrition at all. He was furious with me when I started bodybuilding at age sixteen. He did everything he could to make me quit. My mother on the other hand instilled in me an interest in nutrition and health from an early age.”

THE SHIFT FROM MEAT TO PLANT-BASED

I asked Jim what the one thing was that made him decide to change his eating habits. He said, “When I got married at 27 I had been bodybuilding for over 10 years on a heavy meat, egg, and milk diet. My wife’s diet, before we got married, was primarily vegetarian. After we got married, she started eating more like me.

Shortly thereafter, she started to complain about a severe stabbing pain in her abdomen. We visited many doctors, and I eventually took her to see the now famous Dr. Atkins in New York City, but even with the supplements he prescribed, she got no relief. It was at this time she started to suspect that the problem may be caused by her recent change in diet.

At first, we cut out all beef, chicken, and fish. With this change alone, her health problems were completely resolved in a few short weeks! After about a year later, I cut out all dairy, including cheese.”

For me, personally, I have never had the challenge of having to change my diet. I grew up vegan, so it was my lifestyle. For most people, and for Jim, it was a developed habit, and not exactly an easy change.

Interestingly enough, Jim states that the most 
difficult  part of the change in diet wasn't the food. 
It was the  lack of support from his family.

His mother was seriously against it, especially after his son was born. “She said that he would not develop properly without meat. Ironically, after my father passed away in his sleep from a heart attack at 62, my mother shortly thereafter adopted a vegan diet, and has been mostly for nearly 20 years now.”

THE PROCESS OF LETTING GO

I asked Jim how long it took to embrace veganism. He said going vegetarian was easy. “However,” he went on, “we started to eat a ton of cheese, especially mozzarella to make sure, I thought, we were getting enough calcium and protein. I remember having up to 20 blocks of cheese in the freezer.” Later, he says, “I became very good friends with my chiropractor who was vegan. He and his wife inspired me to do the same. It has been nearly 30 years now that I have been on a vegan, or plant-based diet.”

Of course, you’re probably thinking the same thing I’m thinking, do you miss meat? But he adamantly stated, “No, never! Believe it or not, even though I ate a ton of meat before I became vegan, I never really liked it. I just ate it because I thought I needed to to get big!”

Jim suggested a book that was (and is still) a strong motivator for him, written by Dr. Agatha Thrash. It is called, “The Animal Connection: The Proven Link Between Cancer and Other Diseases from Animals, and Man”. He stated that, “even if it means going hungry and missing a meal or two,” he’d rather skip out than eat meat.

ADD THIS TO YOUR DIET

I was curious what two foods Jim would recommend cutting out and/or adding first, when deciding to switch to a plant-based diet. His answer was pretty simple:

"Cut out meat and add nuts to your diet."

I asked Jim, “what should a vegan bodybuilder eat a lot of?” He again stated pretty straight forward, “Fruits, grains, nuts and vegetables.”

As you can see, and to my surprise, even as a vegan advocate, that taking your body to the next level (bodybuilding and powerlifting) doesn’t require some extra special, weird foods! So far, he hadn’t said a word about how many shakes he was making, or anything unusual.

COUNTING CALORIES AND CHEAT (“TREAT”) MEALS

When someone is trying go make a huge change in physique, one often envisions a lot of diet . . . pains. One of these dreaded changes is counting calories.

So I asked Jim if he counts calories, and his answer will shock you.

“I never count calories. I weigh myself every day at the same time to see the effect reducing or increasing the amount of food consumed at
dinner. The hungrier I go to bed, the more weight I loose.”

I went further and asked him if he cheats on his diet. And I loved his answer. “I have never looked at eating food that is not entirely healthful as cheating, but as a treat. Whenever there are family celebrations or Thanksgiving, I will eat more food than I usually do, and that may include some white bread.” He went on to say that, “I never have an entire cheat (or treat) day. It will only be for one meal of the day.”

As Jim went on to describe what a “treat” meal looked like, it was still ” —all vegan, of course!” He said, “We also enjoy Papa John’s veggie pizza with no cheese and extra sauce.”

ON THE DAILY MENU

I asked Jim what the number one thing was that he made sure to eat on a daily basis. His answer was a solid . . .

"Pressure cooked beans, every day! Right up there with beans is nuts every day, an ounce or two, 
2-3 times perday."

SUPPLEMENTS

As a bodybuilder, powerlifter and someone that competes, I assumed supplements would be a huge thing.

As I prepared to make a $500. list of supplements for you, he stated that, “In my first 10 years of training in the 1980’s, I took every supplement, protein powder, and weight-gain imaginable, but never really noticed any great gains from any of them. For nearly 30 years as a vegan, I have not taken any supplements, until recently. I go into detail on this topic in my online course.

I asked him if one can actually get body-builder-big without any supplements on a vegan diet, and he said, “Absolutely! I took my body from 200 to 242 pounds in one year with no supplements on a vegan diet.” See his results here.

HOW MANY MEALS A DAY

As a personal trainer, I have worked in small gyms, large gyms and also have private trained. There is a very common number of things that most trainers teach their clients. Number 1, eat frequently. Preferably 6 meals a day. And if you are trying to gain, you have to eat a lot. Number2, I often heard trainers tell their clients not to eat fruit. Personally, I cringed inside at both of these pieces of crazy advice.

Vegan powerlifting — Vegan Thanksgiving at the Gurtner’s. Jim at the head of the table, his wife, daughter, son, and his son’s wife.

I wanted to know from Jim how exactly he maneuvered these total myths. Since he’s got a little more experienced than I, and actually competed on a vegan diet, he’d have some great advice.

When I said, “A lot of trainers tell their clients to stay away from fruit, what do you think?” He replied with: “I think this advice is absurd!”

My next question was, “how many meals do you recommend eating per day, and is it the same for a regular gym-rat as it is for a bodybuilder?” Jim said to eat, “2-3 times a day max. Serge Nubret, who came in second place to Arnold Schwarzenegger in the 1975 Mr. Olympia, followed this meal plan and was far ahead of his time in terms of muscularity and definition.”

VEGAN MUSCLE BUILDING AND CARBS

“How do you feel about carbs?” I asked Jim. He said, “Complex, low-glycemic carbs are essential for the energy needed for intense workouts to suppress myostatin!”

So there you have it my friends. To be big, you don’t have to eat, “70 jumbo eggs a week, a whole rotisserie chicken for lunch, and a 24 ounce steaks for dinner,” which was Jim’s usual before he made the change to vegetarian and then a plant-based diet.

POPULAR FAD DIETS

When I asked Jim how he felt about all these popular diets that pop up, he said that, “The Keto and Paleo diets are so bad for your health. Vegan is the way to go. The majority of longest lived people on the planet are on mostly a plant-based diet.”

I asked him if he was gluten free or recommended it, and he said that he is not gluten-free, and that he does not recommend a GF diet, “unless of course a person has celiac disease.” He went on to say that he feel like, “there are a lot of excellent whole-grain products, rich in fiber, B vitamins, and well as carbohydrates and protein, that you would be missing out on when cutting gluten from the diet.”

I assume you’re probably wondering the same thing I wondered right off the top, and that is . . . protein!

LET’S TALK PROTEIN

The very first question that comes to mind for all fitness enthusiasts is:

 Where do you get your protein as a vegan?

He answered by quoting his recently released book: Vegan Health & Strength – How to Build a Strong, Healthy, and Muscular Body on a Plant-Based Diet.

“Our education system has taught that true, high-quality, and complete sources of protein can only be obtained from meat and dairy products. Any plant-based proteins are mostly low-quality, inferior, and incomplete, . . .”

He said a lot more, but for the sake of shortening things a bit I’ve cut a lot out. Sorry. Please go buy his book! You will not regret it! But carrying on, he says that, “A lack of protein in the diet can only occur when there are not enough calories being consumed. If you are getting enough calories to function normally on a daily basis, you are getting enough protein.” He continues to quote: “. . . all foods have complete proteins and contain the nine essential amino acids needed for health and strength. But how can this be confirmed? By using the readily available USDA Food Composition Database tables on the Internet, to look up the amount of each of the nine essential amino acids that various foods contain.”

“The argument that is most frequently put forth is that protein from most plant sources are incomplete (and therefore, inferior), because they are either deficient or very low in the nine essential amino acids. . . these claims are absolutely false!

By graphing and comparing the relative amounts of each of the nine essential amino acids for various foods using the USDA Food Composition Databases, it can be clearly seen that no plant food is deficient in any of the nine essential amino acids. While certain plant foods, like nuts and beans, have more protein than carrots and apples, but both contain all nine essential amino acids in relatively the same ratios. I have graphed the nine essential amino acids of many foods, including beef, chicken, fish, milk, and eggs, and have compared them to plant-based foods such as nuts, beans, fruits, and vegetables. Many are shocked to see no apparent difference in the relative amounts of amino acids that these foods contain. A table of these graphs is available as a free download from my book’s website.”

ARE YOU GETTING ENOUGH PROTEIN?

I asked Jim if there was ever a point when he just really felt like he was not getting enough protein. Wow, he really feels confident when he answers with a very strong, “NEVER!” He said, “The reason for the concern about getting enough protein, especially for bodybuilding, is that it is widely believed that muscle is being broken down by exercise, and rebuilt by the protein we consume. However, surprisingly enough, this is not the case!”

Jim sent me another excerpt from his book on this subject.

“Search results on Google, for “how do muscles grow,” basically say that muscle is broken down, or even damaged during training, and is rebuilt stronger than before. This idea of rebuilding muscle that has been broken down has given rise to a multi-billion dollar protein supplement industry that promises to rebuild all that muscle that is being broken down out there. But . . .

Is muscle really being broken down by exercise?

For more about what the best sources of protein are as a vegan, read 8 Best Protein Sources for Vegans.

BREAKING DOWN MUSCLE MYTH

As far back as 1981, Joe Weider, who is considered by many to be the father of modern bodybuilding, in his book, Bodybuilding: A Weider Approach, stated the following:

“For decades it was thought that muscle cells were broken down by exercise, and then during periods of rest, built up larger and stronger than they were before being trained. Recent scientific research has tended to disprove this theory, however. Physiologists now support a theory that involves inhibition of catabolism [muscle breakdown]… Your body is in a constant state of building up cells (anabolism) and tearing down cells (catabolism). In most individuals, the rates of anabolism and catabolism are balanced, so the body is in an equilibrium. In other words, it is maintaining its size and bodyweight at a constant level… Research now suggests that this [adding muscle mass] is not done by increasing anabolism, but actually by decreasing the catabolism, which makes the net anabolic rate essentially higher.’

In other words, working out does not break down muscle tissue to be built up later by eating large quantities of protein. Working out simply inhibits the naturally occurring breakdown of muscle tissue. Recent research supports this theory and explains the mechanism behind this.” And Jim fast forwards to 2012, but again, buy his book for all this amazing and new info!

“Doing a search for myostatin will reveal dogs, mice, and cattle with enormous muscles from blocking myostatin production with drugs. But fortunately, there are ways to block myostatin naturally without their use. . . “

"It can be done with intense exercise,  intermittent 
fasting,  and an alkaline diet."

Jim went on to say that, “My goal in the gym is to workout intensely enough to block myostatin. My goal in the kitchen is to prepare and eat foods that will give me enough energy to do so.”

TOO MUCH PROTEIN

From my own experience, these huge guys walking around in the gym would stand around talking about their diet, and I personally remember being blown away at the high amount of protein they would make sure to consume. It was way beyond healthy . . . From what I, as a new personal trainer at the time, had recently learned. So I asked Jim . . .

“Do you believe there’s such thing as too much protein?”

And he said, “Absolutely! It is believed that if on a high protein diet, low carb diet, that the protein will be applied to building muscle, and with low carbs, the body will be forced to burn fat. But what actually happens with low carbs is that the body will end up using protein for energy, which can put a strain on the kidneys.”

So there goes the that whole loads of protein myth.

HOW MUCH PROTEIN DO WE NEED?

I asked Jim, so . . . “How much protein do you recommend to be healthy? And does it differ for someone who doesn’t weight train vs. someone who goes to the gym regularly?

His answer: “If you are getting enough calories, you are getting enough protein. This goes for everyone. Again, muscle growth comes from suppressing myostatin, not from rebuilding muscles damaged from working out.”

Of course, I did take it just a little further, though I kind of already knew what he was going to say, but it never hurts to ask, right?

“Do you recommend a protein shake?” I was a little surprised, that he said yes, but in the context, not so much. He said, “If you are trying to gain weight, like I was to compete in the 242 pound class in powerlifting, I added a protein shake for dinner to increase my calorie intake.”

SHAKE RECIPE:

In a blender put 2 cups of soy, almond, or similar milk. Add two or three frozen bananas and a small amount of some other fruit, frozen if available. I prefer strawberries, or half a cup of blueberries or similar fruit. Avoid adding too many strawberries or blueberries. This will water down the smoothie, and it will start to lose its rich, creamy taste. Blend until smooth.

SUPPORT SMALL BUSINESS

One last thing, Jim Gurtner is an award winning author of Vegan Health & Strength, a book on How to Build a Strong, Healthy, and Muscular Body on a Plant-Based Diet. I’ve included the link so you can get your hands on it and make it your own (above). Enjoy!

That’s it for today folks. Next week we’re going to continue talking with Jim Gurtner about his gym life, inspiration, fitness goals and how he attained them.

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